[From Investigation of Organized Crime in Interstate Commerce: Hearings before the Special Committee to Investigate Organized Crime in Interstate Commerce, U.S. Senate, 81st Cong., 2nd Sess. and 82nd Congress, 1st Sess., Part 10, US Government Printing Office, Washington DC: 1950., pp. 34-38.]

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34        ORGANIZED CRIME IN INTERSTATE COMMERCE

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            ( A press conference was held, following which a recess was taken until 2 p. m.)

AFTERNOON SESSION

            The committee reconvened at 3 p. m., pursuant to the taking of the noon recess.

TESTIMONY OF HENRY PHILLIPS, LAS VEGAS, NEV.

            The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Phillips, do you solemnly swear that the testimony you will give this committee will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I do.

            Mr. HALLEY. Where do you live, Mr. Phillips?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I live here.

            Mr. HALLEY. In Las Vegas ?

ORGANIZED CRIME IN INTERSTATE COMMERCE        35

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Yes, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. You operate the commission room for the Last Frontier?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I try to operate, but I haven't been doing anything since I have been here. I did try to go into business but there is nobody to do business with.

            Mr. HALLEY. How long has it been since there has been nobody to do business with?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I found it that way since I came in here. I tried it out. I haven't been doing any of this kind of business. I just thought I would come in here. Mr. Barron asked me.

            Mr. HALLEY. You had been doing lay-off business in the past, had you not?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, I have been monkeying around, making a bet, taking a bet, or something like that.

            Mr. HALLEY. Your boss here testified that this is a very complicated and specialized operation, and that the reason they have you here is that you are a specialist and that if you weren't you could lose him $100,000 a month; is that wrong?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I am sort of a handicapper, in a way.

            Mr. HALLEY. You wouldn't try to kid us. You are not trying to kid us, are you ? You know the lay-off business, don't you ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Just as I told you, I tried to be in the lay-off business, and there is no people to do business with.

            Mr. HALLEY. When did you come here? How long have you been here?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I think it is in the last—it would be about 6 weeks, wouldn't it, Mr. Moore?

            Mr. MOORE. We opened the building September 1, and you were here at the time it opened.

            The CHAIRMAN. Are you doing business for anybody except the Last Frontier?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No. If they would happen to come in here with some business, a big bet, I would try to lay it off, if I could. If I couldn't, why

            Mr. HALLEY. What has been your gross business since September 1?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I wouldn't say that I have had over—I would say a few thousand dollars?

            Mr. HALLEY. Altogether ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. In 1 day.

            Mr. HALLEY. What has been the total altogether?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Well, the total I wouldn't—I think I didn't average over—the average would be about five, six, seven hundred dollars a day.

            Mr. HALLEY. With whom do you lay off bets?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Any of these rooms downtown that have somebody to make a bet with them.

            Mr. HALLEY. Your phone bill would show where you have been calling. Just tell us the names of the people with whom you had lay-offs ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. If you could get the phone bill, you would see I haven't laid off to nobody.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you call people in Los Angeles ?

36        ORGANIZED CRIME IN INTERSTATE COMMERCE

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. You have never tried to call anybody in Los Angeles?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you call people in any State other than Nevada?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I called one fellow in San Francisco.

            Mr. HALLEY. Who did you call in San Francisco?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I have the number here—Cody.

            Mr. HALLEY. Did you call anybody in New Jersey ?

            The CHAIRMAN. What is the San Francisco number?

            Mr. ROBINSON. Do you know Mr. Hy Goberg?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Yes, sir.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Did you have any business transactions with him?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. A little, not much.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Do you lay off with Hy

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I don't think I have laid off with Hy since I have sat here. I will venture to say I don't think I have laid off $2,000 with him since I have been here.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Do you know Phil Tapper?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I don't know much about him. I have seen him around Los Angeles whenever I have been down there.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Do you think any action is laid off from California?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I don't get from there.

            Mr. ROBINSON. The action you receive

            Mr. PHILLIPS. If I got some action, I got some action in the rooms. Someone would come in and make a bet.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you know Frank Erickson?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I have seen him in Hot Springs, Ark.

            Mr. HALLEY. Have you ever done business with him?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you know Tony Gizzo?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I don't think I do.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you know Harry Russell?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Yes; I do know him well.

            Mr. HALLEY. Have you ever done business with him ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No ; not that I can remember.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you know Tony Accardo?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you do any lay-off business in New Jersey?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Never.

            Mr. HALLEY. Do you do any in Missouri ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Never.

            Mr. HALLEY. You mentioned one man in San Francisco.

            The CHAIRMAN. How about Carroll over in East St. Louis?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I just know him, introduced to him to say hello.

            The CHAIRMAN. Have you ever laid off with him?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Never laid off with him or had any business with him. In fact, I am just a sort of a new man.

            Mr. HALLEY. In the last week have you made any long-distance phone calls from this room?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. In the last month have you?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. In the last month I probably made one long-distance call to Cody's in San Francisco.

ORGANIZED CRIME IN INTERSTATE. COMMERCE       37

            Mr. HALLEY. No other long-distance calls?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No; not that I can remember. I had one long-distance call come in from a small town. Someone bet me $200 on some horse, to place on some horse.

            Mr. HALLEY. We are talking about lay-off betting that you have done here.

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, never. The only lay-off that has been made in the place that I am pretty sure of is Cody, and I made a little lay-off to Hy's place.

            Mr. HALLEY. Where is that?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. In town here. And then sometimes they wouldn't take a bet and I would send some fellow downtown to see I wouldn't lose too much on a horse.

            Mr. HALLEY. You haven't made any lay-offs to any other play except Cody's outside of Nevada ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. Where did you work before you came here?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Well, to tell the truth, I never worked, just would jump around and sit in somebody's office, make a bet on a horse, so and so.

            Mr. HALLEY. Where did you live before you came here?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. In Los Angeles.

            Mr. HALLEY. Were you in the booking business there ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. Did you ever make book in Los Angeles?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. Did you ever handle lay-off bets in Los Angeles? 

            Mr. PHILLIPS. No, sir.

            Mr. HALLEY. I think that is all, Senator.

            The CHAIRMAN. When they bring a big bet in here to be laid off, do you take care of it yourself ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. I take it and lay it off if I can. If I can't, I tell them that I don't want it. It is just like one day Jerry out there, that takes care of the book, come to me and he says, "I have got $600 to win and $300 to show on some 16-to-1 shot." He says, "Can you handle it for the office?" And I called up Cody and asked him if he wanted it. He says he didn't want it. I called up the office here and they said they didn't want it. So I give it back to him.

            The CHAIRMAN. How many phones have you got with long-distance connections here ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Two "l.d.'s".

            The CHAIRMAN. Do you have arrangements made so that you can get somebody quick enough if you have to get them ?

            Mr. PHILLIPS. Well, suppose so, but I haven't got no outs. That is the reason I never care about going into business.

            Mr. MOORE. I might explain, gentlemen, that this room was put in in the beginning, with the idea that there could be lay-off business. By the same token, to be perfectly frank, you are all running around the country investigating the race horse book and the wire and closed all those offices. In addition to that, there has been one track from the time we opened up until right recently—it is two tracks now.

            Now, essentially, there has been no business, when you get right down to it.

            Mr. PHILLIPS. You got the whole story.

38        ORGANIZED CRIME IN INTERSTATE COMMERCE

            Mr. MOORE. There was so little, frankly, that it became obvious after the first few days that Mr. Barron said to Mr. Phillips, "This is no business." And, frankly, the hotel cut out from it altogether, and whatever he takes, it is his. It is a help to us.

            The CHAIRMAN. It is an accommodation to you to have somebody who will take a big one that you don't want, but what he does is on his own?

            Mr. MOORE. It brings more business into the race horse book itself.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Let me clarify something. What distinction is there between the action that is held in the room here and the action that comes into Mr. Phillips?

            Mr. MOORE. The action that is held in the room is operated by the hotel.

            Mr. ROBINSON. Is there a limit there to the

            Mr. MOORE. There is a limit to what we will take, frankly.

            Mr. ROBINSON. And what you won't take, you will give to Phillips?

            Mr. MOORE. If he wants it. If not, we say to the customer, there is no bet.

            The CHAIRMAN. What is the biggest bet you will handle? Of course, that depends on the odds?

            Mr. MOORE. The odds have a great deal to do with it.